Curse

frojack · Jun 25, 2006, 06:04 AM // 06:04

Um... Sacred and secret my butt.

This so old that it actually brings back black and white memories. I suspect that is why you think nobody knows about it.
Oh, and by the way, if you actually want sustainable nuking, remove that god-aweful spell and replace it with glyphs, armour, wards, anything but that. You might even want Obsidian Flesh so you don't get your ass stripped (now that was a joke). You also might want a res to. Pretty useful actually. Plus this is still no match for SS. Anything to the contrary is explicit illusion....

meat shield · Jun 25, 2006, 09:23 AM // 09:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amity and Truth

Battle starts
Your cover enchantment is quickly stripped away. No big deal... now what? Your dual attunement was stripped as well. Damnit, your Energy Management just collapsed alltogether and to get it started again you will have to invest a vast amount of energy again. Those enchantments have spell costs as well, you know?

Scenario 2:
Enchantments up. Battle starts. The enemy quickly drains your energy. How is your energy effiency going to save you from that? Energy lost remains lost. You have your measly 4 pips of regen and are now screaming for a battery necro to get your lousy diesel motor back into business.

Do you now see why Ether Prodigy, while not looking too great on paper, is a much more reliable energy management than Dual Attunement? It has got a very fast recharge, maxes out your energy pips, gets you back into business in no time once your energy hits lower regions, has low energy cost, and to totally finish your fragile dual attunement it is one skill versus 3 skills.
Dual Attunement is fine and sure has its uses. And it's even greater in a perfect environment. But you honestly can't rely on something as a perfect environment.

Those 2 skills you've just freed up, can now however be used to combat your long recharge times and add some TIME EFFIENCY into your build.

P.S.: Don't quote other peoples post and edit nonsense into the quotes. That's just downright lame and is called quotefaking.

im sorry but i simpely recast my cover enchant . if both get shatered sure i got some problem but that only happens if someone uses gaze of contempt on me, wich hapens almost never

i belive dual atunements give far better energy magnement than Ether Prodigy wich chauses exchaustion(or whatever it is spelled)

Quote:

Originally Posted by XvArchonvX

It is vulnerable to interupts, enchantment stripping and is almost tottaly dependant on a monk unless it is modified

doesnt ALL fire eles suffer from the same problem?

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Great Al

...2. pardon me if english isn't your first language, but the post is almost impossible to read....(...)...also, with only 4 offensive spells in your build, it's completely unnecessary to have two attunements.

you are 100% correct at the 1st one but 2 atunements ARE nearcreasy if you want to nuke the hell out of your skills(spam flare whit only 1 atunement any you will see)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Great Al

after rereading the thread, i am PRETTY sure that this is supposed to be a joke thread..i mean look at the pictures.

3x shower WILL chaus shatter and this build will kill ALMOST EVERYTING on the shower-drop-place(inclucing bodyguards) in just 9 seconds
you can get pretty far using hit--> run style to take out all archers and then return to your own base but renewall is , in this chase better

Quote:

You also might want a res to.

READ BEFORE POSTING

if you want to make this suitable for pvp
take out elem atunement

this takes the measter of survival down to 10% health and if you time correct THE PLAYER WILL BE KNOCKED DOWN INSTANTLY AGAIN AND CAN NOT ASCAPE-tested but hard-<---- lol Anet? do you hear this NERF THIS RIGHT NOW

build deleted. i actualy dont want it nerfed. yet

Amity and Truth · Jun 25, 2006, 10:31 AM // 10:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by meat shield

i belive dual atunements give far better energy magnement than Ether Prodigy wich chauses exchaustion(or whatever it is spelled)

You don't even know about exhaustion and how it works, yet you come here and claim your build to be superior to every other Nuker? Wow... just wow... FYI: The exhaustion caused by Ether Prodigy is nothing to really worry about, nor is the small amount of damage (switch your weapon sets to temporarily lower your energy when EP ends)

Quote:

3x shower WILL chaus shatter

Total nonsense. If you're chaining them the right way, they won't cause the enemy to scatter. The AI scatter check is based upon something else:

Multiple AOE Damage from a caster within 3 seconds -> run.

Quote:

and this build will kill ALMOST EVERYTING on the shower-drop-place(inclucing bodyguards) in just 9 seconds

And thor himself, will come from the sky and smite thy mighty enemy... is your build called "sacred" cause of your constant praying that your puny damage will be enough to kill your foes?

Let's do the math (based upon 16 Fire Magic)

Meteor Shower:
3x119 Damage (Armor reliant every 3 seconds)

Incendiary Bonds:
1x68 Damage (Armor reliant)
1x42 Damage (Armor ignoring - Burning - Degen)

Fireball:
1x119 Damage (Armor reliant, Projectile)

Rodgort's Invocation
1x127 Damage (Armor reliant)
1x42 Damage (Armor ignoring - Burning - Degen)

That would be 755 Damage against a 60 AL based target. Sounds nice on paper BUT:

a) PVE Enemies are mostly > Level 20
b) Often have more than 60 AL (a lot more...)
c) Healermobs
d) 2 Second Window inbetween the knockdowns

So taking that into consideration your damage now looks like this (measured against 100 AL, which is quite common amongst PVE Mobs).
We can copy your burning damage, because it ignores the targets armor.

2x42 Damage (Armor ignoring - Degen)

Meteorshower:
3x60 Damage

Incendiary Bonds:
1x34 Damage

Fireball:
1x60 Damage

Rodgorts Invocation:
1x65 Damage

You've now only dealt 423 Damage. Your enemy is now still alive, most probably healing your damage. If you now also take into consideration that PVE Mobs often have insane amounts of health. After you've fired your turret you'll be suffering from the recharge times on your spells. And honestly, really... please don't think "Flare" is a good spell and will easily finish of your enemies :/

Quote:

READ BEFORE POSTING

Learn something about the game, before you come here, claiming you have single handedly invented a new era of Fire Nukers (which you simply haven't). If anything at all, you've gimped an allready not so great (yet common) build.

And don't think A-Net will nerf your funny little build. I don't think they give a damn about some minor weak builds like this. If you want to do something original go Elementalist/Ritualist and fit Earthbind into your skillset.

Grammar · Jun 25, 2006, 06:45 PM // 18:45

I used to used to be an echo nuker, but then I capped Glyph of Renewal and never looked back. Reason: it's more stable, and much more versatile (I'll explain).

Fire: 16
Energy Storage: 13

1. Meteor Shower
2. Rodgorts Invocation
3. Fireball
4. Incendiary Bonds
5. Glyph of Renewal {E}
6. Fire Arrunement
7. Aura of Restoration (for heal & cover enchantment)
8. Rez skill

Glyph of Renewal is used for 2 purposes:
- cast before fire attunemtent before the battle, so if fire attunement gets stripped you can put it back up immediately.
- cast before every Meteor Shower, effectively reducing Meteor Shower's recast time from 60 seconds to 10 seconds (yup, that's right, 10 second recast time for Meteor Shower).

Instead of firing off 2 Meteor Showers in a row and then waiting 60 seconds like an echo nuker, now you can fire off a fresh Meteor Shower every 15 seconds (including the 5 sec. cast time) for a total of 4 Meteor Showers a minute instead of the echo nuker's 2.
Of course, you obviously don't always need 4 Meteor Showers a minute, which is what the other three attack skills are for. I sometimes even use Glyph of Renewal on Rodgot's Invocation in certain situations.

The suprising thing is energy. One look at this build and you'd think there would be an energy problem. But I am constantly amazed at how rarely I run out of energy, granted I am able to keep Fire Attunement up at all times of course.
It also helps that you regain 6.66 energy every time you cast a Meteor Shower (net loss of only 11.33 energy for every Shower not including exhausion), and 4 energy every time you cast Rodgort's Invocation (net loss of 14 energy).
You'd never think you'd be able to cast up to 4 Meteor Showers along with bunch of other stuff in around a minute's time, but somehow you can.
Of course, if the battle drags on for longer than a couple minutes, you're totally boned.

EDIT: The point of this thread is to turn the conversation back towards nuker builds and/or the Renewal vs. Echo debate.

Evilsod · Jun 25, 2006, 08:03 PM // 20:03

I think i'll echo a few words from this thread (no not the mesmer elite). At least spell key frigging words correctly!

Seriously... you need to check your ego. I have never, ever, ever been in a group where someone said 'Your build rules' to ANYONE. That build is nothing more than a standard fire nuker build with those great interchangable elites Glyph of Renewal and Elemental Attunement based on your personal preferance(?).

Believe me that build doesn't kill everything... What it does kill is casters (in FoW), I've ran GoR Meteor Shower ---> Rodgorts Invocation ----> Fireball ----> Immolate (onto 1 of the survivors hoping the rest of the team does something) for quite a while now. Almost everytime i do it the casters end up dead. Shadow Warriors? Your kidding me, it does so little damage to them its pathetic, plus they don't stand still for that long.

Not to mention the counter for interrupts seems to be Glyph of Concentration spamming, which helps with Attunements how? Or of course the magical Mantra of Resolve, which makes you lose that much energy you might aswell of been interrupted.

Have you EVER been FoW? Shadow/Skeleton Mesmers simply love to shatter things, specially just before spikes, if your dead those attunements wont help you much when your revived mid battle with Rebirth (it happens) or Res Signet. Rend Enchantments too is spammed quite frequently by Skales. Doubters Dryders too love Drain/Shatter.

Hence my love of Glyph of Renewal, for an extra 5 energy that will probably regen before i cast it, i can eliminate the recharge from Fire Attunement completely.

primal98 · Jun 26, 2006, 04:54 AM // 04:54

Doesn't look much different then the pre-built build you can use in PVP. In the short run the build works.. but as the battle progresses you will be eaten alive :/ Not really revolutionary... you know whats revolutionary though... the Water-Blood Elemetalist Im working on

~prime

tuperwho · Jun 26, 2006, 05:03 AM // 05:03

I prefer to combo meteor shower with bed of coals and aftershock when I'm not renewal nuking

Leddy · Jun 26, 2006, 05:07 AM // 05:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by meat shield

afther 10 months hearing "you are DA BEST! and YOUR BUILD RULES i decided to give away my nunker build to peeps other than my guild leader(he loves the build and plays nothing else than it)
before he had it he used to seem struck whit a good build cuz echo+renewall isnt really usefull in most chases and ss is ofthe slow(except vs xtreme high armor mosters.

so ik decided to give away my build(called sacred nunker)

1shower
2inc bonds
3fireball
4rodgarst
(as you see it you try this build using 1234 in that folowing wil kill everyting on your path)
5(free slot(often cover enchant or res but i think most ppl will place an echo in here
6elem atunent
7fire atunement
8free slot (ofthen alnother dmg spell like immo flare or phoenix

as you see
2 atunement will give you unlimited nergy so high engery storage is not needed so this build is quite flexible

why i did this?
i hate beng kicked cus i was /mo in place of mesmer and seeing the mesages: "lf echo nunker nothing else"
of couse this build does not as much short time dmg as 3 showers does but 3 showers will chause shatter and will not kill all in the deep of any other high lvl arena but this build does have far better recicicle and nergy agnement(hate seeing "my energy is 9 of 86!" when an echo nunker finishes his combo)

plz give freedback

btw this works well in allance bale cus most noobs (inclucing wariors) will not run away
killed a melee monk and an assa 8 times by that (lol)

dmg pics where 1st meteor strikes

2nd

3rd

resultat on 100 AL target:

This build's ridiculously common in PvE and every AoE fire nuker and their mothers knows how to run dual attune. I've run that build (except Mark of Rodgort in place of incendiary bonds, + Light of Dwayna + Healing Breeze) for the last 9 MONTHS.

Nothing revolutionary.

In PvP, in short, this build sucks. It relies too much on the two attunes being up, and it's not like fire damage is worth it in PvP. Any PvPer with half a brain would see you casting attunes and strip them right off you, leaving you good as dead.

ANet has screwed the entire RPG concept by allowing Warriors to deal the most damage in the shortest amount of time AND take the most damage. In other words, when played properly, Warriors > all. And thats what needs a nerf.

The Great Al · Jun 26, 2006, 05:31 AM // 05:31

I apologize if I came off as being rude, I really do appreciate it when anyone tries to be helpful and shows off their build. However, you did ask for comments, and I guess I was a little too harsh. That being said, I do think this build has potential, but you need to be more open to suggestions. I have had gw for over a year and basically play nothing but elem, except when I run places with my warrior (Which i am a complete noob at). Every few days I try to tweak my build, after all this time I still haven't found one that I am completely happy with.

Kijik Oni Hanryuu · Jun 26, 2006, 05:40 AM // 05:40

I'm not even going to READ the rest of this thread, first off, about the title, too presumptuous(sp?) make me wanna say "Up yours". Second, I was one of the few that could nuke in HA so don't tell me MY build isn't as good as yours. Third, yer build is NOTHING new. Fourth, learn to spell sorry but typo isn't EVEN an excuse. Finally, I can out nuke you anyday don't presume anything. Great Al is nice, I'm not, never disrespect the echo nuker.

meat shield · Jun 26, 2006, 07:44 AM // 07:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

Believe me that build doesn't kill everything... What it does kill is casters (in FoW), I've ran GoR Meteor Shower ---> Rodgorts Invocation ----> Fireball ----> Immolate (onto 1 of the survivors hoping the rest of the team does something) for quite a while now. Almost everytime i do it the casters end up dead. Shadow Warriors? Your kidding me, it does so little damage to them its pathetic, plus they don't stand still for that long.

Not to mention the counter for interrupts seems to be Glyph of Concentration spamming, which helps with Attunements how? Or of course the magical Mantra of Resolve, which makes you lose that much energy you might aswell of been interrupted.
Have you EVER been FoW? Shadow/Skeleton Mesmers simply love to shatter things, specially just before spikes, if your dead those attunements wont help you much when your revived mid battle with Rebirth (it happens) or Res Signet. Rend Enchantments too is spammed quite frequently by Skales. Doubters Dryders too love Drain/Shatter.

if resolve let you lose 7 nergy you wil still gain more than that whit atunements

i think you are wrong att the rend enchentement doesnt it say:
remove 5-8 MONK enchantements from target foe for each one removen you take X dmg

Amity and Truth · Jun 26, 2006, 10:08 AM // 10:08

Nah, basically the effect of Rend Enchantment is that it removes every enchantment it is placed against (up to its limit) though you take damage for each of the enchantments that is a monk enchantment.

For example, your target has the following enchantments on him (random ones, mind you):

Aura of Restoration
Vital Blessing
Healing Breeze
Ether Renewal
Fire Attunement
Reversal of Fortune

That means that the one casting Rend Enchantment will take 3x23 damage (if his Curses Attribute is 16) though everyone of the enchantments will be gone afterwards (Rend removes up to 9 enchantments with 16 Curses).

-> http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Rend_Enchantments

LightningHell · Jun 26, 2006, 11:04 AM // 11:04

I refuse to post in here.

LightningHell · Jun 26, 2006, 11:05 AM // 11:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by meat shield

think you are wrong att the rend enchentement doesnt it say:
remove 5-8 MONK enchantements from target foe for each one removen you take X dmg

How misguided.

Remove 5-8 enchantments from target foe; for each Monk enchantment removed, you take X damage.

pegasux · Jun 26, 2006, 11:55 AM // 11:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

I refuse to post in here.

hehehe you lied and posted in this uber thread. =)

but seriously though, those 4 dmg skills are way too common. hell i used that build when i first started my ele about a year ago, those 4 skills are fun and i got my other guildies using it in PvE groups...but you will get stripped. denying it by saying it's rare is bs. any decent ele will always stay way back and let the tank hold aggro first and then start casting away from others in your party but you will still be stripped. and don't worry your build will never ever ger nerfed. if your asking for a critique from people then learn how to take a critique without getting offended by every critique given. it may not seem so but most are trying to help.

if i ever go fire which is rare cause a SS will out dmg me, i use a similiar build which isn't as prone to stripping. Geomancers FTW!

MS
Rodgorts
Incidiary
Immolate
Fireball
Ether Prodigy
Glyph of Concentration or Glyph of Energy depending on area.
Rebirth

Xpl0iter · Jun 27, 2006, 11:13 AM // 11:13

i second lighting on "refuse to post"

Tera · Jun 27, 2006, 01:16 PM // 13:16

i agree, this build is nothing new, personally i prefer A.echo + fire attunmet + ether prodigy (if thats the one that gives +6 eng regen

)

my normal nuker build is

flare
fireball
rodgorts inoviction
meteor shower
arcane echo
fire attunment
ether prodogiy
res sig

i echo rodgorts as it has a larger AoE effect + burning and more damage per hit when comapred to shower (rods= 127, shower =119 at 16 fire magic)

the 15 sec recharge time of rods means it is more spammable than shower (60 sec recharge) but i still carry shower for the knockdown effect on trapped bosses (body blocking

)

like most builds, i will suffer from eng problems but thats were the attunment and prodogiy come in. if attunment is stripped it does become a pain, and the damage from e prodogiy can and has killed me on a few occasions

like most ppl have siad, nothing new, just depends on ur prefrence and which elites u have capped.

and i will apologize now for any spelling mistakes.

Batou of Nine · Jun 27, 2006, 03:31 PM // 15:31

Dual Attunements... Old News...
MS + Fireball + Rodgarts + Incendiary... Old News...

Echo MS... Old news and 10x better than your build...

And yes, dual attunements do give you near limitless energy. Huge returns means you always have a huge supply, provided both attunements are maintained.

enjoy.

9th Requiem · Jun 27, 2006, 05:30 PM // 17:30

Well, this is a good build, even though a lot of people are complaining about it. Ether Prodigy isn't a good energy management skill. It doesn't give back as much energy as you think, it causes exhaustion, and it strips all enchants. But, it is very quick to recharge, and the damage isn't a problem if you have a good monk(s) and it's not at a vital point in the battle. Dual Enchant is great for nuking in most of PvE due to it's vast energy gain, although you need to be very careful of stripping, in particular in The Deep, in which you may want to switch to something more adaptable.

What really baffles me is this : What makes this so amazing? As far as I can see, it's a very standard dual attunement nuking build. One that has no interupt protection. Nor does it have any res.

Tera, I'm sorry, but flare has no place in a nuker build at all, unless you're using Ether Renewal, in which case you don't have enough enchants.

The Great Al · Jun 27, 2006, 08:03 PM // 20:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tera

i agree, this build is nothing new, personally i prefer A.echo + fire attunmet + ether prodigy (if thats the one that gives +6 eng regen

)

my normal nuker build is

flare
fireball
rodgorts inoviction
meteor shower
arcane echo
fire attunment
ether prodogiy
res sig

i echo rodgorts as it has a larger AoE effect + burning and more damage per hit when comapred to shower (rods= 127, shower =119 at 16 fire magic)

Shower can also hit up to 3 times, and KDs/interrupts whatever is in its range.